Full-time intern for 5 months - being taken advantage of?
First job out of school, I was hired at a boutique HFF/Eastdil as an an intern at $15/hr, 45hr/week. I was hired explicitly with potential to become "full-time" once our office hires another producer (which was slated for that quarter) but we've been focused on opening offices elsewhere.
But here's the problem.... they've unofficially given me the title of analyst. They refer to me as an analyst in meetings and when they tell prospective clients how many analysts we have. I'm also in the CRM as an analyst, and another office brought on summer interns who are explicitly "interns" and don't work Fridays. ...but I'm still being paid 30K before taxes, no benefits...
At first I was proud they considered me part of the team (and they've told me they're impressed with my output when I've asked how things are going) but now I feel like they're just avoiding paying for me.
Yeah you're being taken advantage of. I would immediately schedule a meeting with an appropriate superior to discuss the situation and work out a defined plan for your future if you want to stay at the company. That's pretty poor behavior on the firm's part in my opinion.
I'd say something tomorrow if I were you. Say you're enjoying growing into the role, reiterate your commitment and then state that it was your understanding there would be a path to FT analyst and you feel like you're ready to bridge the gap.
Given that your employers are kind of assholes they'll probably low-ball your offer if they put one together for you. I'd just accept it and start applying for other gigs.
What is a boutique HFF/Eastdil?...
Was just going to ask this.
lol same
It's a debt, equity, I.S. broker w 10 producers, handful from HFF/eastdil. I've decided I'm going to low ball them. If they say 55K+, I'll for 32hrs a week, $38/hr = 48K. Because they're a pretty lax office and I mostly do internal deal scoring and CRM stuff... where else could I work that out? Might as well take advantage of potential flexibility.
so I guess a bunch of guys on here work at boutique Blackstone/Carlyle.
Probably trying to say George Smith Partners/ Meridian Capital/ Madison Realty Capital. Not the best way to describe it.
I second others opinions on the thread, it certainly seems like you've been stored in the shoe box and given just enough sunlight so you don't crash into the walls too much. Like others I recommend speaking to your manager / superior.
There are many ways to approach this topic with your manager, a couple avenues to travel down are: 1.) The soft approach - Ask you manager when you can expect to become a fulltime analyst with FT pay, and keep them to the deadline (in my opinion, this option leaves you open to being strung along further) 2.) The hard approach - You have "the talk" with your manager. Start by saying how much you've enjoyed the role and would like to stay, but under the current circumstances you would have to consider other opporutnities if they arose as the current pay is not enough to live on. If there is anyone in the world that respects a hard and honest conversation, it is typically a career banker.
I wouldn't recommend the "hard approach" unless you're mentally, and financially prepared to leave. However, I have honestly walked a mile in your shoes, and can say with confidence you owe the firm nothing.
One final point to consider with Boutiques is that oftentimes they keep overhead increadibly slim until the firm produces big commision $'s. This seems like it could be the case with your firm, meaning that it doesn't matter how much you kick and scream for FT pay, you're still not going to get it until money flows in. Overhead is still overhead.
Definitely talk to them. My first job was in the investment research department at an investment consultant out of college. I was esentially competing for one full time spot between me and another intern. I got the spot, but they let the other guy stay on full time as an intern until he got another offer. After about 3 additional months full time interning he was essentially another analyst in the group.
As soon as he got another offer and told his manager, literally within 3 hours, HR came and offered him a full-time position. Companies will take advantage of you if they can so sit down and speak with upper management about being converted.
Wow, unconscionable.
100% you getting cucked. Id try talking to them, but for sure start looking for other places.
Let me give you a huge piece of advice for succeeding in that line of work. You will be given nothing you do not ask for. You MUST a) understand your worth to the group and leverage you have and b) put together a thought-out case for a pay raise and make the presentation. Make sure you have comps of how much analysts at other firms are paid.
However, I saw that you primarily handle internal reporting and CRM based tasks. This is not a critical piece of your business. You need to start modeling deals and quarterbacking package production as soon as you can. You may need to prove your worth on these value-add tasks before making the ask - they can find an admin to handle that other stuff for much less than the typical analyst comp.
Piggy Backing off what most are saying...You are being taken advantage of. It's gonna be ok, however there are some things you need to do.
Give it more time, a few more months till the end of the summer or so and wait until the new batch of interns go back to the uni's that they crawled out from.
While you're patiently waiting, focus on what @InVinoVeritas and start quarterbacking more deal packages and production. Take more roles, if you see something needs to be done...do it. Kick ass and take names and don't wait for someone to ask you to do something.
While you're also patiently waiting, start networking after hours. Look for other opportunities that you could potentially jump into. Maybe interview if you get a chance? Either way, it won't hurt to put out feelers for the market. You'll need experience, which goes back to quarterbacking the deal packages. Do as much as you can and use that to sell yourself.
Research comps for salary and compensation in your market. Look at the compensation thread we have. Here is the 2018 CEL Associates (Here is the link to 2018 CEL Associates for Real Estate Professionals). Get an idea of what you're worth and what you want to get paid, but be reasonable!
Wait until the end of the summer, maybe a bit sooner, and have a discussion with your superiors. Below is a link to a thread regarding analyst pay raise expectations. There are some good discussions inside talking about how to talk about it. There is a really good line that says ""I really like my job, I like what we are doing, I dont want to go anywhere else, but I am getting some significant offers, could we talk about compensation?" Add value or show competition, if I was an employer that is what I would be looking at to adjust compensation. Also, I try to build my brand a little bit when I can (of coarse, this only works when you have a work product in line with the image you are trying to build)". You don't have to say that word for word, but it gives you a good idea of how to broach that subject.
Link to Raises for Analysts.
Overall, your goal is to go out there and maximize your value. That starts with getting more experience and then talking to not only your company but other companies as well so that you can create an opportunity to either grow in your current job or find a new job.
Wisest words I've ever heard from a boss were "Learn as much as you can, as fast as you can and never stop learning". But that doesn't mean you shouldn't be paid fair value for what you bring to the table. Know the ins and outs of a deal, try to accomplish before asked and show enthusiasm to learn and get better. Either way it'll pay off with a raise or an opportunity elsewhere. Good luck!
yeah, this is gold, thank you.
Yeah, they're probably taking advantage of you to an extent... But it's part of it sometimes. Use that experience you're getting to springboard somewhere they care about you.
For reference, I worked as an intern at an acquisitions shop for 6 months working 70-80 hours a week getting paid $10, no incentives and required work on weekends. Was brutal but I learned a lot now I'm at a place where my work and personality is valued.
Good luck.
you should apply for jobs at other firms.
nobody "owes" you anything...the market is a place where supply and demand meet...go find a company that is willing and interested in paying you for your experience/ability.
i would suggest you get another offer lined up before you ask your superiors for a raise...you should be in a position to force their hand..or walk to a better offer.
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